{"id":3263,"date":"2023-10-16T05:57:49","date_gmt":"2023-10-16T05:57:49","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/camcab.co.uk\/redesign\/transport-for-london-troubles-for-london\/"},"modified":"2023-10-16T05:57:49","modified_gmt":"2023-10-16T05:57:49","slug":"transport-for-london-troubles-for-london","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/camcab.co.uk\/redesign\/transport-for-london-troubles-for-london\/","title":{"rendered":"Transport For London : Troubles For London"},"content":{"rendered":"

The Elizabeth Line line<\/span><\/p>\n

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We know, because fbb has gone on about it incessantly, that The Elizabeth Line line is the only Underground line\u00a0called “line<\/span>“. You can check on the TfL website “status updates” list.\n
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Notice, of course, that Thameslink, now included on the Underground map, does not feature!<\/div>\n
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A recent snippet in a London newspaper confirmed the complications.<\/div>\n
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It has become one of London\u2019s great transport talking points: is the Elizabeth line a Tube line or a train line?<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n
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The answer, says Transport for London, is neither: rather, the \u201cLizzie line\u201d is in a class of its own.<\/span><\/div>\n

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But that has left some passengers puzzled about fares – whether they are the same as the Tube, and whether pay-as-you-go fare capping also applies.<\/span><\/div>\n

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TfL\u2019s customer director Emma Strain admits the situation is confusing. She said: \u201cSome people think it\u2019s a Tube line. Some think it isn\u2019t a Tube line. Both of them are confused. It is a tricky one for us.\u201d<\/span><\/div>\n

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Just a reminder …<\/span><\/div>\n

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The line to Reading is definitely National Rail and is outside the TfL fare zones. So it is a National Rail line.\n
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The Heathrow branches are in Zone 6, so it acts just like an Underground line. Only it doesn’t. In a desperate attempt to (a) make some more money and (b) keep the Government happy, Mr Khan decreed that all fares to Heathrow should be at peak rates – but only if you travel from or via Zone 1.\u00a0<\/p><\/span><\/div>\n


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Potty!<\/div>\n

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Central London is obviously “Underground” with normal zone fares.\n
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The zones system continues along the Shenfield branch, BUT …<\/p>\n

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… Brentwood is in Zone 9 but the terminus is in the National Rail fares system. And to add to the confusion there are no zone 7 or zone 8<\/span> stations on this bit! The branch to Abbey Wood …<\/p>\n

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… is a simple zone 4 line.<\/span><\/div>\n

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The standard one day Travelcard includes Zones 1 to 6; so when fbb nips up to town to “do” the Elizabeth Line line he can only travel Between West Drayton and Heathrow in the west and Harold Wood and Abbey Wood in the east.<\/p><\/span><\/div>\n


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But ALL Elizabeth Line line stations appear on the National Rail journey planner, as do ALL Overground stations and ALL Thameslink stations. Of course, they all appear on the Transport for London Journey Planner with the exception of routes involving Thameslink!<\/span><\/div>\n

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It is a mess. But the article is, essentially correct.<\/span><\/div>\n

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Elizabeth line fares are the same as the Tube on journeys within TfL\u2019s nine fare zones, which extend to Brentwood.<\/span><\/div>\n

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But passengers travelling to and from Shenfield in the east, and to or from all stations beyond West Drayton in the west, are charged \u201cspecial\u201d rates equivalent to national rail fares. Premium fares are also levied on journeys to and from Heathrow.<\/span><\/div>\n

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TfL board members have become concerned at the cost of using the Elizabeth line to outlying stations, particularly those west of London, where punctuality has plummeted due to track problems.<\/span><\/div>\n

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An ongoing programmer of track repairs and replacement begins over the Christmas shut-down and beyond. Notwork Rail (NOT TfL!) are warning of on-going work on the Reading line.\n
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You wonder why this was not done as part of the whole Elizabeth Line line project!<\/p><\/span><\/div>\n


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Oyster cards cannot be used west of West Drayton \u2014 meaning passengers have to use contactless or buy a paper ticket.<\/span><\/div>\n

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BUT<\/span><\/div>\n

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You can use Oyster Pay As You Go in London on all suburban trains stopping in Zones 1 \u2013 9 and journeys to:<\/span><\/div>\n
Broxbourne, Rye House, St. Margarets, Ware and Hertford East<\/span><\/div>\n
Gatwick Airport<\/span><\/div>\n
Merstham, Redhill, Earlswood, Salfords and Horley<\/span><\/div>\n
Ockendon, Chafford Hundred, Purfleet and Grays<\/span><\/div>\n
Epsom<\/span><\/div>\n
Cuffley, Bayford and Hertford North<\/span><\/div>\n
Radlett and Potters Bar<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n

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So what had Reading done to upset Oyster?<\/span><\/div>\n

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And as a final piece of philosophical fun, you can read up all about National Rail tickets marked “via Thameslink” or “London Terminals”.\u00a0<\/span><\/div>\n

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An illustration of the Elizabeth Line line ticket conditions.\n
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Overground Overly Obfuscating\u00a0<\/span><\/div>\n
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The Overground lines (but not, of course, the Elizabeth Line line or Thameslink) are coloured orange on the Tfl Underground map.<\/span><\/div>\n

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Now Mr Khan has decided that the lines need to be individually named and he is going to spend a huge sum of money (that he han’t got) doing it.\n
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Hmmm? But whatever you do, Mr Khan, don’t make a simple straightforward decision to use the names most folk use already. Please note, only extracts from the Overground map are shown.<\/p><\/span><\/div>\n


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There is the Watford Line …<\/span>\n
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… The Goblin Line<\/span> …<\/p><\/span><\/div>\n

Goblin? Gospel Oak to Barking LINe! Well it is no worse than “Bakerloo”.\n
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… The Enfield, Cheshunt and<\/span> …\n
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… Chingford Lines<\/span> …<\/p>\n

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They all converge on Liverpool Street and, back in the day carried the “Jazz<\/span>” steam-hauled services.<\/p>\n

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The brand returned briefly in the 1980s.<\/p>\n

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So that might be a good name.<\/p><\/span><\/div>\n


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… The Big Circle That Isn’t<\/span> …\n
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Once four distinct routes; the West London, North London, East London and South London lines, the Overground knitted these together into a more coherent group of services,\u00a0<\/p><\/span><\/div>\n


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Based on services operated you might need three names (North, West and East?).<\/span><\/div>\n

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Bit rather than deciding on names (remember the underwhelming Superloop bus brand?) Mr Khan is joining the “Diversity” bandwagon and possible vote grabber.\n
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So be prepared for some crazy and unpopular names which “promote diversity<\/span>“!!<\/p><\/span><\/div>\n


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Back in 2015 there was a proposal to use coloured lines (“cased”, i.e. with a hite line own the middle) for each of the services. Maps are available on line …\n
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… but not good enough to see the full detail. The “Jazz” lines are green.<\/p>\n

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The colours do appear, however, in a better sized list.\n
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STIOP PRESS<\/span> – At 2140 yesterday evening fbb found a high quality map showing the Overground in different colours – and different also from the note above. fbb will include an appropriate PS in tomorrow’s blog. They look so much better than the current all orange.<\/span><\/span><\/div>\n

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Another weird anomaly, easy to overlook,\u00a0 is …<\/p><\/span><\/div>\n


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… The Emerson Park Line …\n
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… which links National Rail services, the Underground District line and out old friend nd the Elizabeth Line line.<\/p>\n

Bit it is all desperately in need of clarification, simplification and, above all, a sensible integrated fares system with understandable and logical zones<\/span>.<\/p><\/span><\/div>\n


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And please, please, sort out Thameslink!<\/span><\/div>\n

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Fat chance, because of self-interested financial and a so-called commercial pressures<\/span>.<\/span><\/div>\n

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Oh for a fully integrated transport system for London!<\/span><\/div>\n

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Hoping to go to Finland tomorrow, where we may find a fully integrated system.<\/span><\/div>\n

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\u00a0Next Nordic Tram blog : Tuesday 17th October\u00a0<\/div>\n

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<\/p><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

The Elizabeth Line line We know, because fbb has gone on about it incessantly, that The Elizabeth Line line is the only Underground line\u00a0called “line“. You can check on the TfL website “status updates” list. Notice, of course, that Thameslink, now included on the Underground map, does not feature! A recent snippet in a London newspaper confirmed the complications. It…<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":0,"featured_media":3264,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[60],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-3263","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-camcab"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/camcab.co.uk\/redesign\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/3263"}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/camcab.co.uk\/redesign\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/camcab.co.uk\/redesign\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/camcab.co.uk\/redesign\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=3263"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/camcab.co.uk\/redesign\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/3263\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/camcab.co.uk\/redesign\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/3264"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/camcab.co.uk\/redesign\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=3263"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/camcab.co.uk\/redesign\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=3263"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/camcab.co.uk\/redesign\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=3263"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}